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	<title>Comments on: What&#8217;s wrong with electronic journals?</title>
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	<description>Mathematics related discussions</description>
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		<title>By: Marcelo Fernandes</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-16995</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Marcelo Fernandes]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2012 01:23:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-16995</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Reblogged this on &lt;a href=&quot;http://nucaltiado.wordpress.com/2012/05/03/201/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Marcelo Fernandes&lt;/a&gt;.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Reblogged this on <a href="http://nucaltiado.wordpress.com/2012/05/03/201/" rel="nofollow">Marcelo Fernandes</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Augusto</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-16329</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Augusto]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Mar 2012 16:14:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-16329</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;ve read the article in The Economist, then I&#039;ve read this article of yours and searched for the price of one back issue of Combinatorica, just for reference. With back issues starting from 140 dollars and ending at 250, it&#039;s no wonder there is such a movement happening.

So, what if &quot;Breakthroughs&quot; existed not only as a web venue, but also had a printed copy? This printed copy could be sent to libraries / subscribers whenever a particular number of pages is reached, or papers would be sent individually as they get approved for publication?

&quot;Breakthroughs&quot; could be a venue with multiple disciplines, with specialist editors for each broad subject and a pool (or community) of editors in a diverse range of specialties, not only on mathematics, but also on other sciences as well.

It could charge a symbolic price for submissions (which is meant to keep time-wasters away), but everyone could consult it online. Subscriptions could be based on broad subject (ie. Maths) or specialties (ie. Combinatorics) and as articles are printed individually, one could also purchase a single printed copy of any article (so one can frame their article and hang it on the wall, for instance).

I&#039;d love to work in this project, if it ever see the light of day, but for that the first thing that Breakthrough needs is editors.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve read the article in The Economist, then I&#8217;ve read this article of yours and searched for the price of one back issue of Combinatorica, just for reference. With back issues starting from 140 dollars and ending at 250, it&#8217;s no wonder there is such a movement happening.</p>
<p>So, what if &#8220;Breakthroughs&#8221; existed not only as a web venue, but also had a printed copy? This printed copy could be sent to libraries / subscribers whenever a particular number of pages is reached, or papers would be sent individually as they get approved for publication?</p>
<p>&#8220;Breakthroughs&#8221; could be a venue with multiple disciplines, with specialist editors for each broad subject and a pool (or community) of editors in a diverse range of specialties, not only on mathematics, but also on other sciences as well.</p>
<p>It could charge a symbolic price for submissions (which is meant to keep time-wasters away), but everyone could consult it online. Subscriptions could be based on broad subject (ie. Maths) or specialties (ie. Combinatorics) and as articles are printed individually, one could also purchase a single printed copy of any article (so one can frame their article and hang it on the wall, for instance).</p>
<p>I&#8217;d love to work in this project, if it ever see the light of day, but for that the first thing that Breakthrough needs is editors.</p>
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		<title>By: El coste del conocimiento &#171; Clionauta: Blog de Historia</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15780</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[El coste del conocimiento &#171; Clionauta: Blog de Historia]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2012 08:21:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15780</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] electrónicas de calidad y acceso libre (o unirse a las existentes), aunque para ello sea preciso olvidar los prejuicios irracionales que alberga buena parte de la comunidad académica. Me gusta:Me gustaSé el primero en decir que te [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] electrónicas de calidad y acceso libre (o unirse a las existentes), aunque para ello sea preciso olvidar los prejuicios irracionales que alberga buena parte de la comunidad académica. Me gusta:Me gustaSé el primero en decir que te [...]</p>
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		<title>By: vcvpaiva</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15700</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[vcvpaiva]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Feb 2012 22:17:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15700</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Reblogged this on &lt;a href=&quot;http://vcvp.wordpress.com/2012/02/12/15/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;LogCat&lt;/a&gt; and commented: 
Need to organize my ideas on the unpleasant subject of commercial publishers. Reposting it here to remind me of doing it.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Reblogged this on <a href="http://vcvp.wordpress.com/2012/02/12/15/" rel="nofollow">LogCat</a> and commented:<br />
Need to organize my ideas on the unpleasant subject of commercial publishers. Reposting it here to remind me of doing it.</p>
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		<title>By: vcvpaiva</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15699</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[vcvpaiva]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Feb 2012 22:15:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15699</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[hi Peter, I&#039;ve learned lots from your long response, thanks. Totally agree that the point is not what to do with breakthroughs, but how to make it possible  to focus on new ways of finding good research results and actually ways of composing or adding these research results together, to accomplish larger tasks within mathematics. 
yes, more stuff like polymath. 
Thank you Tim for keeping up the discussion, it sure needs an awful lot more  discussion to make the momentum of the boycott accomplish something of lasting value. As  mentioned in google+, I think the main problem is that Elsevier is not the only publisher that needs boycotting and it&#039;s still  career-suicide for young people to stop publishing in all commercial publishers. While some of the reasons for disliking electronic journals might be simply anachronisms, it is a fact that even very established open source journals like TAC (Theory and Applications of Categories) do not count a iota for research councils, H-indexes and some  hiring boards. I guess if anyone was asking me what a next step in a movement against commercial publishers ought to be, I&#039;d suggest compiling lists of open source journals in the subfields of mathematics that we&#039;d recommend people to publish in. I know the list for category theory, but when checking the directory of open access journals for logic, http://www.doaj.org/doaj?func=findJournals&amp;uiLanguage=en&amp;hybrid=&amp;query=logic nothing much stands out.  yeah, I know no one was asking, but it would be a good step to know if there are really open access journals in all the subareas that one could direct good ideas to.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>hi Peter, I&#8217;ve learned lots from your long response, thanks. Totally agree that the point is not what to do with breakthroughs, but how to make it possible  to focus on new ways of finding good research results and actually ways of composing or adding these research results together, to accomplish larger tasks within mathematics.<br />
yes, more stuff like polymath.<br />
Thank you Tim for keeping up the discussion, it sure needs an awful lot more  discussion to make the momentum of the boycott accomplish something of lasting value. As  mentioned in google+, I think the main problem is that Elsevier is not the only publisher that needs boycotting and it&#8217;s still  career-suicide for young people to stop publishing in all commercial publishers. While some of the reasons for disliking electronic journals might be simply anachronisms, it is a fact that even very established open source journals like TAC (Theory and Applications of Categories) do not count a iota for research councils, H-indexes and some  hiring boards. I guess if anyone was asking me what a next step in a movement against commercial publishers ought to be, I&#8217;d suggest compiling lists of open source journals in the subfields of mathematics that we&#8217;d recommend people to publish in. I know the list for category theory, but when checking the directory of open access journals for logic, <a href="http://www.doaj.org/doaj?func=findJournals&#038;uiLanguage=en&#038;hybrid=&#038;query=logic" rel="nofollow">http://www.doaj.org/doaj?func=findJournals&#038;uiLanguage=en&#038;hybrid=&#038;query=logic</a> nothing much stands out.  yeah, I know no one was asking, but it would be a good step to know if there are really open access journals in all the subareas that one could direct good ideas to.</p>
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		<title>By: plm</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15545</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[plm]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Feb 2012 13:27:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15545</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Ralph, that would be mathoverflow-type revolutionary. Please proceed, the way you find appropriate. Hopefully you would soon find support -from Cornell library, mathematicians, physicists,...

Thanks alot just for the proposal. I really wish it happens and I am convinced many more would love it.

PS: I tried posting this comment yesterday but it did not work, without any error message.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ralph, that would be mathoverflow-type revolutionary. Please proceed, the way you find appropriate. Hopefully you would soon find support -from Cornell library, mathematicians, physicists,&#8230;</p>
<p>Thanks alot just for the proposal. I really wish it happens and I am convinced many more would love it.</p>
<p>PS: I tried posting this comment yesterday but it did not work, without any error message.</p>
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		<title>By: Scott Morrison</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15456</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Scott Morrison]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Feb 2012 05:23:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15456</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[@Ralph,

I don&#039;t think anyone doubts that software fulfilling any particular requirements can be built. Indeed, any proposal which frames the difficulties as &quot;building software&quot; is probably doomed. The difficult questions that have to be thought through are more along the lines of &quot;how will this coexist with the existing system?&quot;, and &quot;how will this be useful for the first tiny fraction of people using it?&quot;. Imagining a replacement system isn&#039;t very useful by itself; we need to know which directions in the tangent space get us closer.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Ralph,</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think anyone doubts that software fulfilling any particular requirements can be built. Indeed, any proposal which frames the difficulties as &#8220;building software&#8221; is probably doomed. The difficult questions that have to be thought through are more along the lines of &#8220;how will this coexist with the existing system?&#8221;, and &#8220;how will this be useful for the first tiny fraction of people using it?&#8221;. Imagining a replacement system isn&#8217;t very useful by itself; we need to know which directions in the tangent space get us closer.</p>
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		<title>By: Ralph</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15399</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ralph]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Feb 2012 05:10:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15399</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I was just today having a discussion with a colleague of mine how it would not be hard (I have a fair bit of web development experience)  to create a site that acts as a layer on top of arxiv (or mathscinet, or other sources) and allows comments, reviews, voting, etc.  He did think that it could destroy the math environment as we know it, though needs to be done if done in the right way.  As noted above, the tricky part is figuring out how exactly to set it up.

One approach could be to use the reddit system, which has been open-sourced (https://github.com/reddit/reddit/wiki)
The way it works is that there are multiple &quot;subreddits&quot; [ see for example http://www.reddit.com/r/math ] which have a short list of moderators, and to which anybody can submit links, upvote, downvote, and comment.  In this system we could have &quot;subreddits&quot; corresponding either to arxiv categories (math.NT, math.AG, etc) or to ad-hoc online journals where the moderators correspond to a review board.  There&#039;s a notion there of which posts have been verified or not, which corresponds to having a proper reviewer vet the result.  So links to new papers could be submitted and there would be a mix of crowdsourced due-diligence, and certain control and oversight by an editorial board.  One can then search for existing papers, see comments, browse categories, and see both the newest and the top papers per category by day,week,month,year,etc
And since this is open-source all of this could be available immediately, given a good system administrator.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was just today having a discussion with a colleague of mine how it would not be hard (I have a fair bit of web development experience)  to create a site that acts as a layer on top of arxiv (or mathscinet, or other sources) and allows comments, reviews, voting, etc.  He did think that it could destroy the math environment as we know it, though needs to be done if done in the right way.  As noted above, the tricky part is figuring out how exactly to set it up.</p>
<p>One approach could be to use the reddit system, which has been open-sourced (<a href="https://github.com/reddit/reddit/wiki" rel="nofollow">https://github.com/reddit/reddit/wiki</a>)<br />
The way it works is that there are multiple &#8220;subreddits&#8221; [ see for example <a href="http://www.reddit.com/r/math" rel="nofollow">http://www.reddit.com/r/math</a> ] which have a short list of moderators, and to which anybody can submit links, upvote, downvote, and comment.  In this system we could have &#8220;subreddits&#8221; corresponding either to arxiv categories (math.NT, math.AG, etc) or to ad-hoc online journals where the moderators correspond to a review board.  There&#8217;s a notion there of which posts have been verified or not, which corresponds to having a proper reviewer vet the result.  So links to new papers could be submitted and there would be a mix of crowdsourced due-diligence, and certain control and oversight by an editorial board.  One can then search for existing papers, see comments, browse categories, and see both the newest and the top papers per category by day,week,month,year,etc<br />
And since this is open-source all of this could be available immediately, given a good system administrator.</p>
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		<title>By: jscammel</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15287</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jscammel]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Feb 2012 10:41:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15287</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I am a Librarian working in a UK University Library, I don&#039;t doubt the large cultural shift that &#039;open research&#039; will need, but @Pierre Colmez asks &#039;where would we find the people to administrate the new system?&#039; 

University librarians can perform this task. For example, if journals are based at Universities then an infrastructure is already in place via institutional repositories (which are maintained on the whole by Library staff) possibly or platforms using open source software, as others here have already referred to. 

As an alternative approach, Cameron Neylon has written a very interesting analysis in his blog post “The Research Works Act and the breakdown of mutual incomprehension”.    He envisages that funders would perform the content publishing role and “within ten years all major funders will mandate CC-BY Open Access on publication arising from work they fund immediately on publication”. 

Other factors which I don&#039;t think have yet been mentioned are that University Library and Computing staff spend many, many hours negotiating licenses with publishers, maintaining authentication systems, training institutional staff and students to navigate these authentication systems which can be tricky as there is a lack of standardisation amongst publisher websites. So, instead of these time-consuming, costly activities staff could concentrate on maintaining open access systems, and ensuring ease of access. 

I understand the wish to be published in a prestigious journal, but could this evolve to being published by a prestigious University in their repository or equivalent? The concept of a journal could be maintained but would it still be needed?  The academic community also relies heavily on various citation metrics, including of course the impact factor of a journal. Perhaps these need re-thinking as well. At the article level, free tools like Google Scholar Citations are available. Not perfect, but if the development of a new model for academic online publishing adopts the principles of a Semantic Web as first proposed by Sir Tim Berners-Lee then it should be possible to develop tools to generate these metrics.

Content already owned by publishers may still be subject to subscription fees, but in time perhaps these can be re-negotiated. As others have noted, this transition needs a strong will, but does online publishing of academic research still need the traditional publishers?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am a Librarian working in a UK University Library, I don&#8217;t doubt the large cultural shift that &#8216;open research&#8217; will need, but @Pierre Colmez asks &#8216;where would we find the people to administrate the new system?&#8217; </p>
<p>University librarians can perform this task. For example, if journals are based at Universities then an infrastructure is already in place via institutional repositories (which are maintained on the whole by Library staff) possibly or platforms using open source software, as others here have already referred to. </p>
<p>As an alternative approach, Cameron Neylon has written a very interesting analysis in his blog post “The Research Works Act and the breakdown of mutual incomprehension”.    He envisages that funders would perform the content publishing role and “within ten years all major funders will mandate CC-BY Open Access on publication arising from work they fund immediately on publication”. </p>
<p>Other factors which I don&#8217;t think have yet been mentioned are that University Library and Computing staff spend many, many hours negotiating licenses with publishers, maintaining authentication systems, training institutional staff and students to navigate these authentication systems which can be tricky as there is a lack of standardisation amongst publisher websites. So, instead of these time-consuming, costly activities staff could concentrate on maintaining open access systems, and ensuring ease of access. </p>
<p>I understand the wish to be published in a prestigious journal, but could this evolve to being published by a prestigious University in their repository or equivalent? The concept of a journal could be maintained but would it still be needed?  The academic community also relies heavily on various citation metrics, including of course the impact factor of a journal. Perhaps these need re-thinking as well. At the article level, free tools like Google Scholar Citations are available. Not perfect, but if the development of a new model for academic online publishing adopts the principles of a Semantic Web as first proposed by Sir Tim Berners-Lee then it should be possible to develop tools to generate these metrics.</p>
<p>Content already owned by publishers may still be subject to subscription fees, but in time perhaps these can be re-negotiated. As others have noted, this transition needs a strong will, but does online publishing of academic research still need the traditional publishers?</p>
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		<title>By: Elsevier, la AAA e la rivolta in favore dell'Open Access &#124; Professione Antropologo</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15202</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Elsevier, la AAA e la rivolta in favore dell'Open Access &#124; Professione Antropologo]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Feb 2012 19:13:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15202</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] non pensava di dare inizio a un vero e proprio movimento, come ha spiegato in un post successivo. Ma come egli stesso scrive, evidentemente si è trattato del momento più [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] non pensava di dare inizio a un vero e proprio movimento, come ha spiegato in un post successivo. Ma come egli stesso scrive, evidentemente si è trattato del momento più [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15190</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Anonymous]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Feb 2012 16:36:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15190</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I agree.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: WarriorClass III</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15189</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[WarriorClass III]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Feb 2012 16:00:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15189</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I found this enlightening:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5syRnaXwpg]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I found this enlightening:</p>
<p><span class='embed-youtube' style='text-align:center; display: block;'><iframe class='youtube-player' type='text/html' width='450' height='284' src='http://www.youtube.com/embed/N5syRnaXwpg?version=3&#038;rel=1&#038;fs=1&#038;showsearch=0&#038;showinfo=1&#038;iv_load_policy=1&#038;wmode=transparent' frameborder='0'></iframe></span></p>
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		<title>By: Knowledge Workers of the World, Unite❢ &#124; Inquiry Into Inquiry</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15182</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Knowledge Workers of the World, Unite❢ &#124; Inquiry Into Inquiry]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Feb 2012 14:04:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15182</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] Post 1 [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Post 1 [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Knowledge Workers of the World, Unite❢ &#124; Inquiry Into Inquiry</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15181</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Knowledge Workers of the World, Unite❢ &#124; Inquiry Into Inquiry]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Feb 2012 14:00:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15181</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] Re: What’s wrong with electronic journals? [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Re: What’s wrong with electronic journals? [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Jon Awbrey</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15177</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jon Awbrey]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Feb 2012 13:18:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15177</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[There are indeed Big Picture questions that open up here — the future of knowledge and inquiry, the extent to which their progress will be catalyzed or inhibited by collaborative versus corporate-controlled information technologies, the stance of knowledge workers, vigilant or acquiescent, against the ongoing march of global corporate feudalism — and maybe this is not the place or time to pursue these questions, but in my experience discussion, like love and gold, is where you find it.  Being questions of this magnitude, they will of course arise again.  The question is — who will settle them, and to whose satisfaction?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are indeed Big Picture questions that open up here — the future of knowledge and inquiry, the extent to which their progress will be catalyzed or inhibited by collaborative versus corporate-controlled information technologies, the stance of knowledge workers, vigilant or acquiescent, against the ongoing march of global corporate feudalism — and maybe this is not the place or time to pursue these questions, but in my experience discussion, like love and gold, is where you find it.  Being questions of this magnitude, they will of course arise again.  The question is — who will settle them, and to whose satisfaction?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Yemon Choi</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15164</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Yemon Choi]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 23:49:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15164</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I can&#039;t say I have (arXiv submissions have been increasing for some years now) but this is only a &quot;feeling&quot; and it would be good to see some numbers on this]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can&#8217;t say I have (arXiv submissions have been increasing for some years now) but this is only a &#8220;feeling&#8221; and it would be good to see some numbers on this</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Krautzberger</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15151</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Peter Krautzberger]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 18:08:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15151</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Alexander, I don&#039;t know what modularization would mean for mathematics, but I doubt that it&#039;s impossible.

In a way, MathOverflow has modularized mathematics, in a way Polymath has done it (but has yet to scale to a wider audience), in a way, blogs do. 

Could we imagine a figshare of mathematics? A micro-contribution journal? A journal for &quot;failed attacks on a problem&quot;? Could we imagine crowd-sourced survey articles? 

I think we have enough creative people in mathematics that have thought about these things but there&#039;s no incentive to spend time realizing them -- after all &quot;you could write a paper instead&quot;...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alexander, I don&#8217;t know what modularization would mean for mathematics, but I doubt that it&#8217;s impossible.</p>
<p>In a way, MathOverflow has modularized mathematics, in a way Polymath has done it (but has yet to scale to a wider audience), in a way, blogs do. </p>
<p>Could we imagine a figshare of mathematics? A micro-contribution journal? A journal for &#8220;failed attacks on a problem&#8221;? Could we imagine crowd-sourced survey articles? </p>
<p>I think we have enough creative people in mathematics that have thought about these things but there&#8217;s no incentive to spend time realizing them &#8212; after all &#8220;you could write a paper instead&#8221;&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Taylor</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15146</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mike Taylor]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 15:48:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15146</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[In my field (vertebrate palaeontology), PLoS ONE has quickly established itself as one of the more prestigious venues.  I think this is in part because the PLoS journals exploit their e-only nature to allow authors arbitrarily many high-resolution figures (specimen photos), videos, digitiser point-clouds, CT-slice stacks, etc.  (For what it&#039;s worth, PLoS ONE&#039;s current impact factor of 4.411 is better than the great majority of specialist palaeontology journals.  But we all know better than the trust IFs.)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In my field (vertebrate palaeontology), PLoS ONE has quickly established itself as one of the more prestigious venues.  I think this is in part because the PLoS journals exploit their e-only nature to allow authors arbitrarily many high-resolution figures (specimen photos), videos, digitiser point-clouds, CT-slice stacks, etc.  (For what it&#8217;s worth, PLoS ONE&#8217;s current impact factor of 4.411 is better than the great majority of specialist palaeontology journals.  But we all know better than the trust IFs.)</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Matthews</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15144</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Paul Matthews]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 15:17:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15144</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Nothing is wrong with electronic journals. In dynamical systems, the electronic-only SIADS has rapidly established itself as one of the top journals in the field. It has an impact factor of about 1.5. The annual subs is only $190. 

This journal does 
&quot;exploit its electronic character in order to have a positive appeal.&quot;
Colour images and videos can be attached to papers.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nothing is wrong with electronic journals. In dynamical systems, the electronic-only SIADS has rapidly established itself as one of the top journals in the field. It has an impact factor of about 1.5. The annual subs is only $190. </p>
<p>This journal does<br />
&#8220;exploit its electronic character in order to have a positive appeal.&#8221;<br />
Colour images and videos can be attached to papers.</p>
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		<title>By: plm</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15138</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[plm]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 13:18:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15138</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Has anyone else felt an increase in arxiv submissions since Tim started posting on the issues of mathematical publishing and Elsevier?
I feel this may have been very significant. I would see this as a major positive impact of Tim&#039;s initiative.

A related discussion on the issue of Elsevier replacement, journal scope and rankings: http://sbseminar.wordpress.com/2012/01/30/thinking-about-elsevier-replacements/]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Has anyone else felt an increase in arxiv submissions since Tim started posting on the issues of mathematical publishing and Elsevier?<br />
I feel this may have been very significant. I would see this as a major positive impact of Tim&#8217;s initiative.</p>
<p>A related discussion on the issue of Elsevier replacement, journal scope and rankings: <a href="http://sbseminar.wordpress.com/2012/01/30/thinking-about-elsevier-replacements/" rel="nofollow">http://sbseminar.wordpress.com/2012/01/30/thinking-about-elsevier-replacements/</a></p>
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		<title>By: jake lyles</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15113</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jake lyles]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 05:34:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15113</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[As an unaffiliated individual who retains an interest in Computer Science and Economics, I urge more journals to go the way of Journal of Machine Learning Research, which is completely open access: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Journal_of_Machine_Learning_Research

In addition, I support legislation to free, open archiving of all papers which were funded with federal money. 

JSTOR doesn&#039;t even sell subscriptions to individuals. It&#039;s ridiculous that access to knowledge is so exclusive in the age of the internet.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As an unaffiliated individual who retains an interest in Computer Science and Economics, I urge more journals to go the way of Journal of Machine Learning Research, which is completely open access: <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Journal_of_Machine_Learning_Research" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Journal_of_Machine_Learning_Research</a></p>
<p>In addition, I support legislation to free, open archiving of all papers which were funded with federal money. </p>
<p>JSTOR doesn&#8217;t even sell subscriptions to individuals. It&#8217;s ridiculous that access to knowledge is so exclusive in the age of the internet.</p>
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		<title>By: jake lyles</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15112</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jake lyles]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 05:29:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15112</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Would &quot;Breakthroughs in Mathematics&quot; be open access, or would reading its papers still be restricted to those who pay tuition or that receive a paycheck from a research institution?

I urge you to support open access, and not merely fleeing the abuses of the worst publishers. Only through open access can the great masses of people gain access to knowledge, many of whom hold graduate degrees and maintain the capacity and inclination to enjoy academic work. Some of them might even be inspired to contribute themselves to humanity&#039;s body of knowledge. 

Open access allows people to build tools for indexing, discussing, and sharing papers, like Mendeley. Support open access and let a new age of open scholarship bloom.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Would &#8220;Breakthroughs in Mathematics&#8221; be open access, or would reading its papers still be restricted to those who pay tuition or that receive a paycheck from a research institution?</p>
<p>I urge you to support open access, and not merely fleeing the abuses of the worst publishers. Only through open access can the great masses of people gain access to knowledge, many of whom hold graduate degrees and maintain the capacity and inclination to enjoy academic work. Some of them might even be inspired to contribute themselves to humanity&#8217;s body of knowledge. </p>
<p>Open access allows people to build tools for indexing, discussing, and sharing papers, like Mendeley. Support open access and let a new age of open scholarship bloom.</p>
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		<title>By: Albert Mao</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15106</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Albert Mao]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 02:10:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15106</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I believe that a many-sided approach will be more effective in bringing about change in the behavior of Elsevier and other publishers. Besides refusing to perform referee and editorial duties for them, we should also encourage institutional libraries to boycott their publications, thereby depriving them of a principle revenue stream.

This boycott should be easier to organize than the one being proposed, because there are fewer institutions than individual scholars and they are already motivated to reduce expenses. Universities also seem to exhibit silly peer-imitating and hierarchical behavior patterns that can be exploited. For once, the interests of cost-cutting administrators and students / faculty are in perfect alignment: stop funding the parasites that exploit us.

PS Drop the &quot;Breakthroughs in&quot;. Just &quot;Mathematics&quot;. It&#039;s cleaner =)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe that a many-sided approach will be more effective in bringing about change in the behavior of Elsevier and other publishers. Besides refusing to perform referee and editorial duties for them, we should also encourage institutional libraries to boycott their publications, thereby depriving them of a principle revenue stream.</p>
<p>This boycott should be easier to organize than the one being proposed, because there are fewer institutions than individual scholars and they are already motivated to reduce expenses. Universities also seem to exhibit silly peer-imitating and hierarchical behavior patterns that can be exploited. For once, the interests of cost-cutting administrators and students / faculty are in perfect alignment: stop funding the parasites that exploit us.</p>
<p>PS Drop the &#8220;Breakthroughs in&#8221;. Just &#8220;Mathematics&#8221;. It&#8217;s cleaner =)</p>
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		<title>By: Libres pensées d&#039;un mathématicien ordinaire &#187; Publications: science, money, and human comedy</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15097</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Libres pensées d&#039;un mathématicien ordinaire &#187; Publications: science, money, and human comedy]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 23:03:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15097</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] What&#8217;s wrong with electronic journals? by Tim Gowers [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] What&#8217;s wrong with electronic journals? by Tim Gowers [...]</p>
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		<title>By: André Joyal</title>
		<link>http://gowers.wordpress.com/2012/01/29/whats-wrong-with-electronic-journals/#comment-15091</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[André Joyal]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 22:05:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gowers.wordpress.com/?p=3940#comment-15091</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The hiearchy within the mathematical community maybe questionnable, but a hiearchy is unavoidable. I like to imagine that the mathematical community is some kind of eco-system. Each field is a niche where a mathematician of some sort can grow, live and reproduce.  Every niche is depending on other niches. A large variety of fields is probably essential to the health of mathematics as a whole. The eco-system of mathematics is itself a kind of super-niche within the larger system of science, which is part of human society. The analogy between the mathematical community and a living biological system is not perfect, but it is helping me to understand the nature of the problem we are facing. Some publishers have evolved from been useful economic partners to the role of parasites. They are are now sucking the blood of our universities via our libraries. The scientific community is exploited. We better get rid of them! Otherwise, they will take control of science by using their copyrights.

A possible action could be to invite every mathematical institute of the world to create a journal that would reflect their history and personality. For example, the Fields Institute could create a journal called *The Fields Institute Mathematical Journal* or another journal called *The HSM Coxeter Mathematical Journal&quot;, since Coxeter spended most of his career in Toronto.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The hiearchy within the mathematical community maybe questionnable, but a hiearchy is unavoidable. I like to imagine that the mathematical community is some kind of eco-system. Each field is a niche where a mathematician of some sort can grow, live and reproduce.  Every niche is depending on other niches. A large variety of fields is probably essential to the health of mathematics as a whole. The eco-system of mathematics is itself a kind of super-niche within the larger system of science, which is part of human society. The analogy between the mathematical community and a living biological system is not perfect, but it is helping me to understand the nature of the problem we are facing. Some publishers have evolved from been useful economic partners to the role of parasites. They are are now sucking the blood of our universities via our libraries. The scientific community is exploited. We better get rid of them! Otherwise, they will take control of science by using their copyrights.</p>
<p>A possible action could be to invite every mathematical institute of the world to create a journal that would reflect their history and personality. For example, the Fields Institute could create a journal called *The Fields Institute Mathematical Journal* or another journal called *The HSM Coxeter Mathematical Journal&#8221;, since Coxeter spended most of his career in Toronto.</p>
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